More Yahoo Complaining
Jan 7th, 2008 by Don Ray
Unfortunately, I dropped into the Yahoo of David site today and it is overflowing with bickering and belching about problems in Panama.I chose not to respond there, since it really won’t make much difference to some and I just don’t care to get in a long running argument. However, it did bring up a couple of things that might be worth blogging about.
One thread was related to Panamanians being non-client oriented, when it comes to service. The example that was given was that an individual had purchased some cheese in Romero’s in Volcan and when it was rung up on the register, the price was higher than what was marked on the product. The individual was upset and eventually the clerk had to go ask the manager. When the clerk returned, she said the price was of the register was correct and the prices would be changed on the rest of the cheese.
The individual was upset and said that while he was waiting, several other clients left. His expectation was that Romeros should charge what was marked. Most likely those that left were not mad at Romero’s but with the individual that was making a scene.
So here are my thoughts. Stores in the US would probably charge you what the sticker said. However, the stores in the US probably have a business model that can afford to write off a mistake by an employee. Most stores in Panama cannot. If a clerk made a mistake ticketing products and the register computers are correct, then they will not absorb the clerks error for a mis-marked the item.
This is not always true. I bought some diet 7-up in El Rey because the shelf was marked with a low price. When it was rung up I noticed the difference and asked why the shelf price wasn’t valid. The cashier asked a manager to accompany me back to the area to verify the price. When we got there, the manager saw the price that I had remembered. He looked closer and noticed that there was a price under the first price and it was higher. As it turns out, the diet 7-up was higher and regular 7-up was the price I had seen. A clerk had just not placed the correct prices below the appropriate product. I was fully prepared to pay the higher price, but the manager instructed the cashier to charge me the cheaper price. They didn’t need to do that.
Another thread was related to stores not stocking replacement parts and doing repairs in places like PriceSmart. What you have to realize in Panama is that large items, such as refrigerators, are never serviced by the store. If you buy an Amana refrigerator or a Whirlpool washer and drier at PriceSmart or Casa Gala and have problems, both of these stores will call the company that is authorized to service the product. Most stores in Panama do not service what they sell.
Now you can say that Panama is backward and bitch and moan and carry on, but understanding the system makes living in Panama much easier. There is no question but what some things are less convenient, when you don’t live in the US. But if you have to have US convenience and customer service, then live there.
Someone else had written that they had seen Apple PCs for sale in PriceSmart and commented that they would not be serviced in Panama. I also saw that they currently have some Apple and some nice HP desktops. I feel certain that the Apple PCs will be serviced by Apple in Panama. There are several Apple stores in Panama City. Dells and HP are going to be serviced by the authorized service center for Panama.
Everyone’s experience with service centers may be different even with the same center. I had a Canon camera that broke. There is only one Canon service center and it is in Panama City. I gave them my camera and checked on a monthly basis. In 6 months it hadn’t been fixed. On the last contact, Canon had authorized them to give me a new replacement camera. I had a second Canon that broke and the quote to fix it was higher than buying a new camera, so I went with the later option. I gave the camera to my daughter to be serviced in Texas and it still hasn’t been fixed in the US either. In all my dealings with the Canon center, I was treated fairly, but not necessarily timely. I have heard of others that have said they would never own a Canon camera because of the poor service by the PC service center.
I had a Toshiba Laptop that I had to have serviced and it required another trip to PC. It was fixed, but it took about a month. Service time is not going to be as fast as in the US typically. Sometimes you may find the service better than the US. I think I was 5 years old in the US, the last time I had a doctor make a house call. I had a house call twice, when I lived in Boquete.
In Panama, it is VERY important to have your purchase receipt. If you lose it, I can almost guarantee that any product will not be serviced under its guarantee. I have purchased a couple large items from PriceSmart that have required service and it has always been taken care of. I have also bought a couple of small items at PriceSmart that broke within the guarantee period and both times, PriceSmart just gave me a new product.
Another recent thread was that you can’t get products here that have the same level of quality, because everything comes from China. Well, maybe the author hadn’t bought much in the US lately, because most products there come from China too. Remember the Apple PC? The one I bought in the US was manufactured in China. Tommy Hilfiger, Levi Jeans, etc., may very well come from China too. When I was in the US last July, I bought several pieces of clothing and all the name brands came from China.
I have seen the same brands here and the quality was the same. The price here has been higher in most cases. I can buy no-name brands here that may come from China or India for less price and some very cheap. For the most part, I find the quality of clothes here acceptable without having to buy a name brand.
If you come here expecting perfection, you are going to be disappointed. I think bitching and moaning in a Yahoo group does nothing of benefit for anyone. People considering coming to Panama may decide not to strictly because of the way you wrote your post. I am sure a comment may come in, that you shouldn’t just accept poor service or that there is nothing wrong with telling it like it is.
I would tend to agree, but there is a right way and a wrong way to do it. If you have a bad experience and want to warn others, just write the post and don’t provide your judgment. Let others decide if the situation is offensive to them. I don’t always follow my own advice, but when I don’t here, I am typically called for it. I try to present the good along with the bad.
I am tired of writing. I think I need to not enter the Yahoo group for another period of time.
you are right don i hope if their friends in the states are like them, they are giving them ll that negative info so we do not get one of their clones down here with them. maybe we will just have to start monitoring those special people a little closer. i get real tired of their drivel and it is the same ones most of the time. some of the other groups have taken them off.!!!!!!!!!
Hi Dave, Thanks for dropping in.
Don,
I don’t know about the cheese price occurance but I felt I received excellent service last time I was in Romero’s Volcan store! I walked in to the pharmacy right in Romero’s and asked the pharmacist about pricing on a prescription. She quoted the price and then proceeded to hack off 12% for the Jubilado discount! All this without asking for a cedula from me or anything (I don’t have one!). The years must be taking their toll on my appearance and it’s now a forgone conclusion that I’m an old fart..but I’ll take the discount just the same!
Matter of fact, I’ll be stopping in to Romero’s probably in a few months if we don’t go to Columbia or back to the States instead!
You going to Ohio, or did you mean Colombia?
Strange as it sounds, living in David has been a real adjustment for me after living in Costa Rica for 25 years. There have been plenty of frustrations over the last two years. The concept of customer service is almost non-existent.
But people need to realize that until just a few years ago David was a quiet backwater (as opposed to “backward”). Most of the unskilled workers here (who earn a pittance) are very nice people but fairly limited in the grey matter department.
You just have to learn patience; I know I have. I now question almost nothing, to avoid upsetting scenes. That may sound like compromise but getting all hot and bothered just doesn’t get you anywhere, it only creates resentment. I believe that, as guests, foreigners need to keep a low profile.
On the plus side, I have a video camera that I couldn’t get fixed at the Panasonic dealer in San Jose. I took it to a small store in Doleguita and they fixed it for $25.
Hi Peter,
Thanks for adding to the discussion.
Hello, and congratulations for a well maintained blog!!
Living in David is hard, specially if you make minimum wage like many of the people that work in those supermarkets do. But the problem of customer service goes even deeper. Chiriqui, and the majority of the interior was not visited as much as is it today, the standards of service vary from place to place, and in the case of Chiriqui, they are almost non existent. Proof of that is that when you give anybody a tip of a dollar or more, they look surprised. I am confident that customer oriented behavior will be better over time. Just treat people with respect and not like servants and they will show you what they are capable of. Now back to Romero. The majority of the people that sets the prices and change them are merchandise associates that work for the different wholesale companies around the country. If the policy has not changed from two years ago, Romero will ban from their chain anybody who set a wrong price, and they ended up paying for the mistake. I saw more than one poor devil scorted out for failing to do their work right! In the other hand, people will be people, and in some cases, “customers” will move the stickers from one item to another in order to get the cheaper price. But here is the trick, look at the last four numbers of the barcode in any item, and they will match the little numbers at the corner of the sign, if they not, don’t even try to talk to the supervisor, becuse they will say “no”. If the product is unmarked and you have doubts, just check with barcode scanners located in the salesfloor. If there is none, just ask politely for the supervisor in charge. If he or she is unprofessional, or not polite, just ask for his or her name and the phone number of the general manager. That will tame them belive me!!
Best regards from a Chiricano in Connecticut.
Hi Marcos.
Thanks for taking the time to leave a comment.
Don Ray:
Well said! It is not fair to compare the customer service received in US with the one received in a small town in a third world Country (Panama). And you are right to point Chiriqui has not received the flow of turist (and newcomers) in the past as now, and was not prepared to cater to them. THey are carching up quickly, though.
Finally, please, like you say, newcomers need to adapt to Panama, their new home, with its goods (wheater, food, housing, etc) and bads (power outages, people bunrning trash, long wait to get things fixed, etc), and not expect Panama to adapt to them.
Thanks
Jaime (CA)
Hi Jamie,
I have adapted to most things, but I will never adapt to city neighbors burning trash. That is just plain dumb and needs to stop. It is not healthy for the community and when you have trash pickup within 30 feet of where you burn and you have yard workers, it is even more ridiculous.
A long time ago a deputy chief I worked for used to say “Things aren’t as good as they used to be…and they never were.” In the agency I work for today we say that there are only two good offices in the entire agency - the one you left and the one you are going to. Reading some groups I suspect this saying is not limited to my agency.
I thought the whole point of living in a new country was to be challenged with new situations when there is no job to do this. Maybe not. But I have to wonder how happy they were back “home.”
Well said Mike.
They should have called it “Yahoos”. It’s full of ‘em.
I used to be a big fan of the groups, but many of them have been taken over by a small group of know-it-alls and have deteriorated to the point of uselessness. You’d think a bunch of 60 somethings would have better things to do than act like children.
Hi Henry. I agree. When I came here, you could actually get some good information in the Yahoo groups. Now they are dominated by a few strong personalities. I go there once in a while to see if anything has changed.
What really disgusts me are the people that go there just to obtain new gringos to buy whatever they are selling. Carpet baggers, I call them.
Don,
FWIW, I do not and have never posted on any Panama Yahoo Group but it sounds like it may be a good outlet…
KK
Yes, you might enjoy it.
Hi Don Ray,
First, and most importantly to me, I wish to differ on the opinion that people “unskilled laborers” with little education are lacking in grey matter. What they are lacking in is education. There’s a difference between the definition of “ignorant” if you will, and “stupid”, or low IQ. I find that reference to be, well, basically racist, or classist , or ignorant at best. I’ve met a fair number of educated “stupid” people, as well as some very intelligent, but uneducated “ignorant” people. So that’s my opinion on that.
I’ve also shopped in Romero’s in Volcan, and had nothing but friendly, helpful, gracious service. So, maybe much lies in one’s attitude toward others, and acceptance that mistakes happen, and a general sense of graciousness and empathy.
Also, you find unhelpful people everywhere. In Portland, OR where I currently live, I’ve met both. I’ve wandered supermarkets and other stores, desperately searching for a staff member to help me. I’ve been blown off and ignored. But for the most part, people are definitely helpful, friendly, and just trying to make it through the day in their job. Any “service” position requires a certain kind of personality or attitude. Some got it, some not. I know. I’ve also worked in the service profession and have met my own percentage of - well for the sake of civility - let’s just say, “difficult” patrons. I was especially not fond of people snapping their fingers at me for service. Solution. I usually ignored them. Not worth the tip.
Guess that’s all for now. Too many “whines” to address. One could spend two lifetimes complaining. All I know, is I only got one, at least this time round, and I’d rather spend my simple grey matter on other concerns. Guess I got a little fire going here, eh?
Take care. Carry on. Hope to see you soon
Charlotte
No arguments from me. I tend to agree with all that you had to say.
Thank you. I feel that maybe I’ve been a bit intolerant and unkind in my reaction to that comment. Sometimes we write things quickly, and make a “mistep” in our expression of things. So, no intention to offend any other commenter. I’ve had my “wish I could rephrase that” moments.
OK. Done. Charlote
Hahahaha. I have always thought that some people don’t realize how lucky that they were born into certain families. Many people are born with a silver spoon in their mouth and never have to work to make money. Others are born in third world countries and never get the chance to do anything for them selves.
I know that many would say, that anything is possible if you really apply yourself. I think that can be true if you are not too far down the totem pole. People that are born in the US at any level of status have an advantage to those born in many other parts of the world.
Don Ray:
I agree with Charlotte. In Chiriqui some people lack some refinement and maybe education, but do not call them lacking in gray matter (as Peter comment before). I also think it is offensive. THe majority of them are hard workers earning little and are doing the best they can.
Regarding the trash burning, I also never got used to it when I was growing up there. I have many neighbors and even my Dad who used to do this and it was annoying. Sorry you have to put up with it. But what is worse is when they are burning sugar cane before the harvest: literally it rains soot form the sky.
Also I heard on the news they are cancelling the one laptop for a child program. Did you know this?
See you,
Jaime (CA)
Hi Jamie, I have been lucky and never been close to the burning of the suger cane, but I understand that it is pretty nasty.
I hadn’t heard anything about the cancellation of the one laptop program. I have heard that Intel has dropped out of the program, but the last I knew the program was not thinking that would have much if any effect.
Sorry If my use of “grey matter” was politically incorrect or justly poorly chosen. I didn’t mean to imply people here were stupid. But I don’t think “uneducated” covers it either. The system keeps them poor and denies them access not only to formal education but a whole host of stuff that would enable them to develop as people. I’m from a poor background myself and have poor friends here. I don’t despise or look down upon anyone.
Don,
I meant the country, ‘Columbia’. Do they hate gringos down there? I heard if you stay in the north, there’s no problem generally… Seriously, I don’t know. The ‘boss’ wants to visit ‘San Andreas Island’ but the hotel reviews etc aren’t too hot vs. the expense IMO…
KK
Then you need to learn to spell it Colombia, because the hate all gringos that can’t spell it.
Don,
Why don’t you post the URL for the Yahoo Panama forum on this Blog? That way I’ll have it and those of us who wish to spew some venom can do so there rather than here!
Thanks,
KK
You can find many Yahoo groups by searching the Yahoo group area for Panama. I don’t want to be responsible for them having any more venom than they already have.
Message to KK - if you’re planning a trip to Colombia, then you might want to go somewhere other than San Andres Isla (note correct spelling). San Andres doesn’t represent the real Colombia in any way, shape or form - possession is under dispute between Colombia & Nicaragua. What you will find is a small, dirty island with small dirty beaches, EXTREME water issues, crowded with ‘resorts’, perpetual tourists from CR and duty free shopping. Who knows - you might just enjoy it!